TO KALICHARAN JI 15.3.12
I AM A CHEMICAL ENGINEER & A SCIENTIFIC RESEARCHER. YOU MUST BELIEVE NOTHING WHICH DOES NOT APPEAL TO YOUR REASON. WHERE DID YOU LEARN THAT AUM WAS THE 1ST SOUND IN THE WORLD. FROM PRIESTS WHO THEMSELVES DID NOT KNOW. THIS SECRET WAS HIDDEN FOR 3000 YEARS & A HINT GIVEN IN THE GITA MENTIONED BY LORD KRISHNA AS VIBRATIONS. . BUT HE DID NOT EXPLAIN ITS MEANING, .EXCEPT SAYING IT AS VIBRATIONS. BUT WHAT VIBRATIONS. BY A CHANCE ONLY THAT I FOUND THE SCIENTIFIC MEANING OF OM BECAUSE I DO REASERCH ON PREVENTION OF CANCER & DEMENTIA.
THE MEANING OF WHICH YOU MAY CALL OM OR AUM IS THE SIMPLE EXERCISE CALLED "PRANAYAM" NOT DONE BY 99.99% OF INDIANS. NOW I WILL EXPLAIN IT & THEN REPLY TO ME PLEASE.
SAY THERE ARE 1 TRILLION CELLS IN THE BRAIN OF A AVERAGE PERSON, IN SOME MORE(HENCE KNOWN AS A BRILLIANT PERSON) & IN SOME LESS( HENCE KNON AS A DULLARD) BY THE NATURAL LAWS OF NATURE JUST LIKE SOME ARE TALL, SHORT,FAT,THIN ETC. NOW EVERY DAY 1 MILLION OF THOSE ORIGONAL CELLS DIE SO IN A PERIOD OF A PERSONS LIFESPAN OF 60.70.80,90,100 YEARS, SAY WHEN 80% OF THE CELLS HAVE DIED, THE PERSON LOSES HIS ABILITY & MEMORY ALSO CALLED DEMENTIA TILL THE NUMBER OF BALANCE 20% CELLS ARE NOT ABLE TO SUSTAIN THE BODILY FUNCTIONS & THE PERSON DIES. THE REASON WHY OM IS CALLED AUM IS BECAUSE IN THE PRANAYAM BREATHING EXERCISE IS DONE IN THE MANNER OF AAAAAUUUUUUUMMMMMMMMMM....NOW HOW DOES THIS EXERCISE HELP & IS THE GREATEST SECRET SO SIMPLE, IT IS NOT PRACTISED.
WHILE DOING THE EXERCISE IN THE FIRST PART IT IS SIMPLE DEEP BREATHING WHICH ADDS OXYGEN TO THE BLOODSTREAM KEEPING THE BODY & BRAIN HEALTHY WITH THE OXYGEN IN THE AIR. IN THE LAST PART TRY JUST NOW DOING THE SOUND MMMMMMMMMM.... WILL PRODUCING VIBRATIONS IN THE BRAIN SO THAT INSTEAD OF THE 1 MILLION CELLS DYING DAILY,THE VIBRATIONS OF MMMMMMMM AWAKEN PART OF THE SLEEPING CELLS & SIMULTANEOUSALLY ONLY LET 1/2 A MILLION CELLS TO DIE DAILY. THUS THE RATE OF THE DAILY DYING CELLS IS REDUCED. NOW THE PERSON DOING THIS EXERCISE HAS COMPRATIVELY MORE BRAIN CELLS THAN THE PERSON WHO IS NOT DOING THIS PRANAYAM EXERCISE. HOPE YOU AGREE
.
THEREFORE I GIVE YOU A CHALLENGE TO DO THIS PRANAYAM EXERCISE FOR ONLY 2 MONTHS AT LEAST 5 TIMES A WEEK WITHOUT FAIL & SEE YOUR ABILITY TO SOLVE ANY PROBLEM THAT COMES IN YOUR LIFE, WHETHER IT BE OF HEATH,FAMILY,WORK,FINANCIAL OR ANYTHING. OTHERWISE INFORM ALL YOUR GROUP THAT MY EXPLAINATIONS WERE INCORRECT & SHOULD NOT BE BELIEVED, FOR THERE IS NO GREATER PROOF BETTER THAN ONES OWN EXPERIENCE. I REST MY CASE NOW. THE BALL IS IN YOUR COURT NOW
HUMBLY YOURS
balbir singh-a devotee of our lord krishna whose teachings also we must not follow blindly ,
From: "KHARCHARAN1@aol.com" <KHARCHARAN1@aol.com>
To: CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com; caribbeanhindus@yahoogroups.com; INDIANSINHUNGARY@YAHOOGROUPS.COM; indianscommunityinjapan@yahoogroups.com; dallasindians@yahoogroups.com; gujjuworldwide@yahoogroups.com; notelsewherespecified@gmail.com
Sent: Thursday, 15 March 2012 1:19 AM
Subject: CHN (since 2002) Re: Balbir Singh Here are more Meaning on AUM
To: CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com; caribbeanhindus@yahoogroups.com; INDIANSINHUNGARY@YAHOOGROUPS.COM; indianscommunityinjapan@yahoogroups.com; dallasindians@yahoogroups.com; gujjuworldwide@yahoogroups.com; notelsewherespecified@gmail.com
Sent: Thursday, 15 March 2012 1:19 AM
Subject: CHN (since 2002) Re: Balbir Singh Here are more Meaning on AUM
Before the beginning, the Brahman (absolute reality) was one and non-dual. It thought, "I am only one -- may I become many." This caused a vibration which eventually became sound, and this sound was Om. Creation itself was set in motion by the vibration of Om. The closest approach to Brahman is that first sound, Om. Thus, this sacred symbol has become emblematic of Brahman just as images are emblematic of material objects.
The vibration produced by chanting Om in the physical universe corresponds to the original vibration that first arose at the time of creation. The sound of Om is also called Pranava, meaning that it sustains life and runs through Prana or breath. Om also represents the four states of the Supreme Being. The three sounds in Om (AUM) represent the waking, dream and deep sleep states and the silence which surrounds Om represents the "Turiya" state.
Because the first of the three states of consciousness is the waking state, it is represented by the sound "A" pronounced like "A" in accounting. Because the dream state of consciousness lies between the waking and the deep sleep states, it is represented by the letter "U" which lies between the "A" and "M". This "U" is pronounced like the "U" in would. The last state of consciousness is the deep sleep state and is represented by "M" pronounced as in "sum." This closes the pronunciation of Om just as deep sleep is the final stage of the mind at rest. Whenever Om is recited in succession there is an inevitable period of silence between two successive Oms. This silence represents the "fourth state" known as "Turiya" which is the state of perfect bliss when the individual self recognizes his identity with the supreme.
The Symbol Om
Just as the sound of Om represents the four states of Brahman, the symbol Om written in Sanskrit also represents everything. The material world of the waking state is symbolized by the large lower curve. The deep sleep state is represented by the upper left curve. The dream state, lying between the waking state below and the deep sleep state above, emanates from the confluence of the two. The point and semicircle are separate from the rest and rule the whole. The point represents the turiya state of absolute consciousness. The open semicircle is symbolic of the infinite and the fact that the meaning of the point can not be grasped if one limits oneself to finite thinking.
The Power of Chanting Om
- The chanting of Om drives away all worldly thoughts and removes distraction and infuses new vigour in the body.
- When you feel depressed, chant Om fifty times and you will be filled with new vigour and strength. The chanting of Om is a powerful tonic. When you chant Om, you feel you are the pure, all pervading light and consciousness.
- Those who chant Om will have a powerful, sweet voice. Whenever you take a stroll, you can chant Om. You can also sing Om in a beautiful way. The rythmic pronunciation of Om makes the mind serene and pointed, and infuses the spiritual qualifications which ensure self-realization.
- Those who do meditation of Om daily will get tremendous power. They will have lustre in their eyes and faces.
Meditation on Om
Retire to a quite place, sit down, close your eyes and completely relax your muscles and nerves. Concentrate on the space between your eyebrows and quieten and silence the conscious mind. Begin to repeat "Om" mentally while associating the ideas of infinity, eternity, immortality, etc. You must repeat Om with the feeling that you are the infinite and all-pervading. Mere repetition of Om will not bring the desired result. Keep the meaning of Om always at heart. Feal Om. Feel that you are the pure, perfect, all-knowing, eternal, free, Brahman. Feel that you are absolute consciousness and the infinite, unchanging existence. Every part of your body should powerfully vibrate with these ideas. This feeling should be kept up all day long. Practice regularly and steadily with sincerity, faith, perseverance and enthusiasm in the morning, midday and evening.
Mantras
This mantra has enormous power. Some of the benefits conferred by reciting the Moola Mantra are:
- The Divine energy freely flows from the feet of Amma to the different systems of the body. The holy vibrations penetrate all the cells and revitalize the entire system.
- Eradication of one's Karma.
- Gives you what you rightfully deserve.
- Helps solve ailments and genuine problems.
- Confers blessings leading to prosperity and a happy life.
- Helps one to reach the highest spiritual pedestal (Mukti).
- Prevents fatal accidents.
In a message dated 3/14/2012 5:13:12 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, om.pune@yahoo.in writes:
.TO RAM RATTAN JIBLIND FAITH HAS BEEN THE DOWNFALL OF INDIA FOR THE LAST 3000 YEARS. DO YOU KNOW THAT 99% OF INDIANS & PANDITS IN INDIA OR ABROAD DO NOT KNOW THE TRUE MEANINGS OF "OM' OR THE "SWASTIKA " WHICH WE PUT OUTSIDE OUR HOMES. I HAVE QUESTIONED MANY OF THEM. WHEN I ASK THEM THEY TELL ME TO COME TOMMORROW. WHEN I GO THE NEXT DAY THE PANDIT HIDES BEHIND THE DOOR & SENDS TO ME HIS COLLEGUE SAYING THAT THAT PANDIT HAS GONE TO HIS VILLAGE WHILE I CAN STILL SEE A LITTLE OF HIM HIDING BEHIND THE DOOR. DO YOU KNOW THAT THE ISKON HAVING 60 CENTERS AROUND THE WORLD DO NOT USE THE WORD OM IN ALL THEIR BHAJANS OR SLOKAS AS OTHER PANDITS DO. IF QUESTIONED ,THEIR STANDARD ANSWER FROM ALL IS THAT THEY ARE HOLY SYMBOLS FIT TO BE WORSHIPPED & THAT THESE ARE HOLY & SACRED SYMBOOLS FIT TO BE WORSHIPPED. EVEN LORD KRISHNA IN HIS HOURS LONG DIALOGUE W ITH ARJUN IN THE GITA MENTIONS 'OM AS VIBRATIONS" WITHOUT EXPLAINING WHAT IS ITS MEANING OR HOW IT CAN BE USED FOR THE BETTERMENT OF MANKIND TO LEAD A LIFE OF HARD WORK, GOOD HEALTH, PROSPERITY & HAPPINESS UNLIMITED TILL I & A FEW OTHERS LIKE ME STUMBLED UPON THE SECRET OF KRISHNAS MEANING OF 'OM'. I MUST GO TO THE HIGH MOUNTAINS IN THE HIMALAYAYS TO MEET THE RISHIS & RECONFIRM WHETHER MY INTERPRETERATION IS CORRECT BEFORE I CAN TEACH IT TO ALL.MY UNDERSTANDING OF IT IS SO SIMPLE AS TO BE UNBELIEVEABLE. LEARNING THE SIMPLE YOGIC BREATHING EXERCISE CALLED "PRANAYAM' FROM ANY YOGA TEACHER FOR 15 MINUTES IN 2 DAYS ONLY ,THEN DOING IT AT HOME IN A GARDEN IF CONVENIENT OR IN CLOSED ROOM SO AS NOT TO DISTURB OTHERS WITH THE FAN ON AT A MEDIUM SPEED & DOING THE BRATHING EXERCISE WHICH IS LIKEAAAAOOOOOMMMMMMMMMM...... THE MMMM...SOUND CAUSES VIBRATIONS IN THE MIND AWAKENING THE BRAIN CELLS & INCREASING THE INTELLIGENCE LEVEL OF THE PERSON MANIFOLD WITHIN 2 MONTHS DONE DAILY 20 TIMES IN THE MORNING, AS I DO; TO SUCH A EXTENT THAT SUCH A PERSON CAN EASILY SOLVE HIS PROBLEMS IN LIFE & BE THE HAPPIEST PERSON. THAT IS WHY THE GREATEST GURU IN THE WORLD TODAY B.K.S. IYENGAR WAS INVITED TO CHINA LAST YEAR TO LEARN THE SECRETS OF THE VEDAS FROM HIM & AS A GRATITUDE ISSUED 3-5 COMMEMORATIVE POSTAGE STAMPS IN HIS HONOUR. IMAGINE THAT FROM CHINA A HOSTILE NEIBHOUR OF INDIA ,SAYING THAT INDIANS ARE NOT FIT TO GOVERN THEMSELVES & SHOULD BE BALKANISED IN THE SAME WAY WHAT USA DID WITH THE ARMS RACE & BROKE UP RUSSIA INTO MULTIPLE COUNTRIES.
BELIEVE NOTHING WHICH I OR ANY PANDIT TELLS YOU UNLESS IT STANDS THE TEST OF REASON IN YOUR MIND GIVEN TO BY GODTHANKS TO YOU ALL FROM A HUMBLE DEVOTEE OF LORD KRISHNA ALSO WHOSE TEACHINGS VALID FOR THOSE TIMES MUST ALSO BE ACCEPTED ONLY IF THEY ARE REASONABLE & NOT FOLLOWED BLINDLY.balbir singh================ Dear Balbir ji,
Namaskaram. I would appreciate it if you desist from writing in all CAPs. It is very irritating and, as the moderator, I have to read it or press the DELETE key. So far, I have endured the pains, but my tolerance limit is about to be breached.
Many thanks for understanding.
Ramesh.================== . ---- Forwarded Message -----
From: Prabhu Ramrattan <rattan7777@yahoo.com>
To: "CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com" <CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, 13 March 2012 8:38 AM
Subject: Re: CHN (since 2002) Blind acceptance vs Debate/inquiriesSomdatji,I do accept that inquiries and debates are essential to promote Hinduism and I do reject blind faith and ignorance, however, I still feel that people who do good karmic activity in the community should be recognized and credited as such. I feel that there is a place for all to promote Hinduism each according to what he / she can do.The handful of fearless ones gone before were indeed formiddable but where are they now!!!? If any new ones exist now, what impact is there? What's the long term prognosis especially that Hinduism is being attacked on all sides?Sri Ramakrishna once indicated to a devotee who was about to throw away a broken murti into the ganges, asking whether he would discard his child if his arm was broken like the murti or repair it?Here ar some thoughts for debates and inquiries.Should we discard Pandits like Tilakji?What can be done to improve Pandits like Tilakji?How are we to disseminate their teachings effectively among one billion Hindus?Who will do it ? How long will it take to educate the ignorant Pandits and the masses?How will we stop superstition and the occult practices? ( ads. currently thriving in Caribbean media)What and who are the target population of The Caribbean Hindus Forum in terms of impact to change values attitudes etc.?Are the mases attuned to the vedas, Upanishads, Brahma Sutras? If Not!! Who's going to do it for them?What do pandits do? Where they originate? Why you say that only debates and inquiries support Hinduism and not Pandiits? Do we just discard thousands of Pandits?Would it be easy to train the existing Pandits or create a new vanguard of Hindu Monks/ Missionaries?Do we have the resources to sustain growth or diminishing returns by misuse?Who will compete with the Abrahamic religions to prevent conversion in th mean time?By the way I do not condone superstition or blind faith which work for some people and the saying from the shastras...All is God ...Sarvam khalvidam Brahma ....may have something to do with it.Hari OM!!!RamrattanFrom: Mahabirs <mahabirs1@yahoo.com>
To: "CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com" <CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2012 8:58 AM
Subject: Re: CHN (since 2002) Blind acceptance vs Debate/inquiriesRamrattan ji:You write with a degree of measured reason and therefore it should be clear to your conscience that the issue at hand is the ludricous proposition by a man who carries himself as "Pandit", that we must accept, not debate ideas. It is not about whether he is likeable or what he does (I have highlighted your comments below). This does not interest me.The ideas of Hinduism interests me. Inquiries and debates are essential elements of Hinduism and Dr. Rameshji has beautifully discussed the Upanishads, Nachiketas and Swami Vivekananda in this context. Without inquiries and debates Hinduism is dead. Human civilization would be dead. The search for truth, spirituality, God, knowledge is all about inquiries and debates, not blind acceptance. Those who tell people to accept ideas blindly, do so in ignorance, and spread ignorance. And ignorance leads to fear. It is only beacuse of fear that people do not openly speak out against blind acceptance of ideas that cripple the mind into bondage. They are fearful to offend, fearful to take a stand, fearful of repercussions. People of intelligence do not live in fear, they do not stifle their conscience, they are not fearful of what others might think of them, they debate and inquire deeper and deeper and experience the endless beauty of ancient and modern ideas that advance human civilization. Inquiries and debates lead to enlightenment and freedom of the mind to soar to new heights, to advance civilization further. This is the nature of Hinduism. "Pandits do not sustain Hinduism" at all. That is propoganda material only. Hinduism has been sustained by inquiries and debates that remove cowardice, that lead to fearlessness, these are the ideas of the Vedas, Upanishads, Bhagvad Gita, Swami Dayananda, Swami Vivekananda, Chatrapati Shivaji, Jhansi Rani, Rani Durgavati, Keshav Hedgewar, etc. In addition to the textual ideas, these great souls, highly intelligent, fearless beings, engaged in the fearless activities of reforming rouge ideas, and opposing both rouge elements in, and external threats to Hinduism.- Somdat******************************Regarding Pt. Tilak...I have observed that the moderators here are of a high caliber and I applaud them for the work they do to their target readers. BUT.....For the good work he does...I do like Tilakji and he has his population to serve and he promotes Hinduism to our people and he meets their needs without which other faiths will convert them with ease. All Pandits sustain Hinduism the only way they know how!!!! With time, the growing intellectuals in Hinduism will increase and we shall have more logical and reasoned practices in Sanatan Dharma cascading to the followers. This forum has already enlightened many including myself and I wish to see it proliferate. Remember Hinduism is a pyramidal structure with few scholars at the apex. If the masses at the base were to move away a collapse will ensue.From: RAMESH GAMPAT <rameshrgbadri@gmail.com>
To: CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 7, 2012 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: CHN (since 2002) Blind acceptance vs Debate/inquiriesSomdatji,Namaskar. I began to respond to this purohit, but did not get the time to finish it. You have read my mind like a book, and I quite like what you have written. However, I would like to add a few words to yours because many Hindus share what Mr. T. Seeratan has written, if only because they do not know better.The message from this purohit is indeed a very baffling. Among other thing, he castigated others for his own sins. But his main message is plain rubbish. Where in our Dharma is it said that we should discard our brain and become parasites? That is the problem with Hindus: we do not think for ourselves and are dependent upon the so-called pandits to think for us. This "pandit" is surely happy with our meekness and timidity, and in fact encourages it.There is a beautiful story in the Katha Upansihad about a little boy named Nachiketa. You are all familiar with the story, but it was a about a little boy who used his brain. Not to outwit anyone, but to persuade Yama to teach him about what comes after the mystery of death. That is, Nachiketa was asking for knowledge of the self - Atam jnanam. Since his brain was alive, he used it instead of sending it into profound slumber.The Lord of Death was reluctant to grant nachiketa his third boom. Yama told the lad to ask for any other thing, any material thing, even the heavens. Nachiketa responded that material things would perish, and that he was not interested. Thus ensued a back and forth discussion – open, frank, without rancor, respectful - between Yama and Nachiketa. Eventually, the boy persuaded the Lord to death to grant his wish.Nowhere in this inspiring and great story does blind faith play a role. Truth does not come to s/he who does not think. The end of thinking is death, or, what is the same, living as if dead. Truth comes through discussion and challenges, courage and persistence, sympathy and love.Sawami Vivekananda - Narendranath Dutta before - was gifted with a scientific mind. He was curious, skeptical and did not accept anything at face value. He questioned things, asked for hard proof, and discard what cannot be proved. When he met Sri Ramakrishna for the first time, he courageously asked the venerated Master: "Sir, have you seen God?" Without a moment's hesitation, Sri Ramakrishna replied: "Yes, I have. I see Him as clearly as I see you, only in a much intenser sense." Master and disciple did not see eye-to-eye during their early meetings. Naren - that was what Sri Ramakrishna used to call him - wanted hard proof, and the Master was equally persuasive. You know that happened: the world was gifted with a sage who was admired and respected by all people all over the world.Once again, Sami Vivekananda did not accept things what other say or wrote. He probed, asked questions, he tried to clarify his own thoughts. That is path to knowledge, not blind faith. The Upanishads pioneered this method eons ago: all the Upanishads are discussions between Rsihis and their students. The Rishis tried to stimulate their students to think and ask questions, to clarify their thoughts, and not to paralyze their brains.Best,RameshOn Mar 6, 2012, at 10:36 PM, Mahabirs wrote:Tillack ji:I think that you are confused as to the importance of debates/inquiries/dialogues/discussions in the evolution of Hindu culture. Your suggestion that since the scriptures were written by "Rishi & Munis" they cannot be questioned, but must be accepted is ludicrous. Rishis and Munis were humans (not God) and therefore they can make errors. Even students used to question them. It looks like you do not understand that Sanatan Dharma is made up of a set of ideas from which an aspirant selects based on debates/inquiries/dialogues.You also seems to be peeved about titles. You need to understand that terms like "Rishi", "Muni" and "Pandit" (all terms that you have used) are all honorary titles before names. If you are upset with honorary titles, be the example for others and drop the Pt. title that you have used infront of your own name.On the contrary, people with academic degrees (BA, MD, PhD, etc.) have earned them by taking examinations. We should be proud of the academic achievements of Hindus. Those who bash academic education are on the wrong train.Among the vast ideas of Hinduism, Bhakti is not the only thing that leads to God and you are wrong to write that "this should be our only belief." Every "Pandit" should be aware of the concept of vivek toviragya and that hould settle your confusion about debates/inquiries. .Hindus have used the rich traditon of inquiry and debate to learn many things. Here are some examples: 1) Priests who conduct rituals are in fact not Pandits; 2) Caste is a clear hoax when the genetic evidence is examined; 3) An Aryan invasion of Hindustan never happened; 4) Brahmin is not a Sanskrit word and it is not used in any Hindu text; 5) The earth is not flat; 6) The Ramayana of Tulsi Das and Valmiki have major differences.- SomdatFrom: "Seerattan9230@aol.com" <Seerattan9230@aol.com>
To: CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, March 5, 2012 7:14 AM
Subject: Re: CHN (since 2002) ABOUT RAVAN & RAMDear Loving Brothers and Sisters and Children of the Rishis,
I just have a glance at this conversation and could see this debate is excelling, but seeing you all as intellectuall beings, you all must understand, Our ancient Scriptures are written and given to us by our ancestors, "The Rishis and Munies". They are much more knowledgeable that any human kind living in Kali Yug. They don't have a DR, or an MD or PT. etc. Title before their names."no offense to anyone" They are simple Rishis and Munis. We all must accept their teachings and do not debate their intellect or try to have a face to face confrontation which may excel into an ugly situation. This is wasting our valuable time, instead, we should be doing what is desperately needed to elevate the less fortunate ones.
The instruction given by Lord Shiva and Parbatie in the second Shloka of the Ramayana is SHRADHA AUR VISHWAASH. Faith and believe/trust in your mutual understanding of God. If you practice Bhakti and Devotion, it will surely take us to God. This should be our only believe.
If this statement offend anyone, then i ask your indulgence.
Jai Shri Ram
Pt. Tillack Seeratan-----Original Message----- From: Dr. Satish Prakash <satishprakash@yahoo.com> To: CaribbeanHindus <CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Mon, Mar 5, 2012 8:25 am Subject: Re: CHN (since 2002) ABOUT RAVAN & RAM
--- On Sun, 3/4/12, Mahabirs <mahabirs1@yahoo.com> wrote:
From: Mahabirs <mahabirs1@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: CHN (since 2002) ABOUT RAVAN & RAM
To: "CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com" <CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Sunday, March 4, 2012, 9:05 AM
Dr. Satish ji:Namaskar. I am curious as to why you propose that "Mara" is not Sanskrit. I think that linguistically this is highly debatable. From three perspectives, I would argue that the word "MaRa" is indeed Sanskrit. First, Ma+Ra=Mara are from the Devanaagri script that forms the basis of the Sanskrit language. Second, Rama (Ra+Ma) is Sanskrit as opposed to the Ram (Hindi) and therefore the reversal of Rama to Mara is Sanskrit. Mara is not a reveral of the Ram (Hindi). Three, the meaning of the word Mara is irrelevant because the intention was Rama (Sanskrit).I agree with you that there should be a textual reference for this occurrence in terms of the way it has been presented. Did Valmiki said this about himself or did somelse did? If so, exactly where? However, I disagree that the contextualization of Mara is not Sanskrit.- Somdat MahabirFrom: Dr. Satish Prakash <satishprakash@yahoo.com>
To: CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, March 3, 2012 8:22 AM
Subject: Re: CHN (since 2002) ABOUT RAVAN & RAM
====================
Satish jiNamaskar and hope you are doing well. Thank you very much for your kind wordsYou are one of the Caribbean Hindus on CHN who is more knowledgeable of Sanskrit than many of us. I would encourage you to share your views and insights with us periodically. Knowledge is empowering, it dispels darkness, and we look forward to learning from you.As the Moderator of the CHN, part of my job is to steer the discussion, to poke members mentally, and that was what I tried to do in the message. As you may have seen from several messages, people are using our discussion to teach others. If we are to serve this function fruitfully, we need to be simple and clear, focussed and result-oriented. The many responses to my message suggest that CHN members respond when nicely provoked!Best,Ramesh=================== --- On Fri, 3/2/12, RAMESH GAMPAT <rameshrgbadri@gmail.com> wrote:
From: RAMESH GAMPAT <rameshrgbadri@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: CHN (since 2002) ABOUT RAVAN & RAM
To: CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com
Date: Friday, March 2, 2012, 3:31 PM
Dear All,Namaskar and many thanks for the "Ravan & Ram" discussion. I am delighted that CHN members take up pertinent issue so enthusiastically.With respect to this discussion, I want to ask two more mundane questions:1. If chanting "Rama Rama" backwards ("Mara Mara") brings moskha, what does this tell us? Could doing evil, instead of good, bring one closer to Divine Reality? I can hear you scream, but I am merely drawing out the logical implications. What is in a name: does name and form matter? Does not concentration and devotion count - identifying oneself with the object worshipped?Incidentally, "MARA" does not seem to be "RAMA" written backwards, at least in English. The overwhelming majority of CHN members do not read Sanskrit and Hindi: they would look at "MARA" and say that it is not "RAMA" read in the reverse. In English, "RAMA" in the reverse is "AMAR."I think that we should endeavor to avoid confusion as try to promote clarity.2. Does it really matter who chanted "Mara Mara," whether it was the sage Valmiki or the demon Ravan? Should we not try to understand WHY the "reverse" chanting was done? I believe that Hindus have a marked propensity to look at the end-state (final outcome) without understanding the PROCESS that led to the end-state.Best,RameshOn Mar 1, 2012, at 1:30 PM, Steve Boodram wrote:Is this the same Valmiki who wrote the Ramayana before it was translated by Tulsi Das?----- Original Message -----From: naroutam singhSent: Wednesday, February 29, 2012 10:32 PMSubject: Re: CHN (since 2002) ABOUT RAVAN & RAMI think it was Valmiki. He was only used to murder and robbery and nothing divine, so he could repeat nothing else but mara.From: Steve Boodram <steveboodram25@gmail.com>
To: CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2012 1:27 PM
Subject: Re: CHN (since 2002) ABOUT RAVAN & RAMNot sure where I heard it from but believe Ravan chanted mara instead of rama and by his repeating these two syllables translated into Rama which earned him muksha.----- Original Message -----From: Balbir SinghTo: CaribbeanHindus@yahoogroups.com ; leena ; CYRUS KAVARANA ; GURPREET SINGH ; renu.malh@gmail.com ; kavitasikka1959@gmail.com ; pooja.isbm16@gmail.com ; Tazeen ; belaluthra@gmail.com ; vibhavig@gmail.com ; duaritu@hotmail.com ; waliareshma@gmail.com ; shaifaligupta@gmail.com ; ravi talwar ; sunildbahl@hotmail.com ; sagar_internationalchess@rediffmail.com ; poonambarolia@rediffmail.com ; alanrs43@yahoo.ca ; soniasingh03@gmail.com ; manju_kamath@hotmail.com ; Rukhsana@yahoogroups.com ; emmdouble@yahoo.com ; dallasindians@yahoogroups.com ; dilsedesigroup@yahoogroups.com ; desi_pardesi@yahoogroups.com ; SINGAPORE_INDIAN_CLUB@YAHOOGROUPS.COM ; caribbeanhindus@yahoogroups.com ; gita-talk@yahoogroups.comSent: Monday, February 27, 2012 11:02 AMSubject: CHN (since 2002) ABOUT RAVAN & RAMHELLONO DOUBT THE LEGEND OF RAM WAS REAL BUT ONE OF THE LESSONS FROM THIS GREAT EPIC IS THAT RAVAN WHO IS WORSHIPED IN SOUTH INDIA & OTHER PLACES WAS IN THOSE TIMES THE MOST KNOWLEDGEABLE PERSON OF THE CENTURIES. HE SAW PEOPLE BEING MURDERED WOMEN BEING RAPED AFTER EVERY BATTLE BY THE WINNERS BECAUSE THERE WAS NO KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD & EVIL. SO HE ABDUCTED SITA KNOWING FULL WELL OF HIS FINAL DEATH BUT NEVER TOUCHED HER.THE SOLE PURPOSE OF HIS ACTIONS WAS TO TEACH THE PEOPLE WHAT IS EVIL & WHAT IS GOOD. SO HE PORTRAYED HIMSELF AS A EVIL BEEING TO TEACH THEM THE CONCEPT OF GOOD & EVILHUMBLY YOURSbalbir singh
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Moderators Rukhsana Group:
Aika Rani, Mumtaz Ali, Sitara Ansari, Lilly, Akhtar,
Contact us at: Aika_Rani@Yahoo.Com
Rukhsana-owner@yahoogroups.com
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